Dorien Morin-van Dam is a social media consultant, organic social media specialist, certified Agile Marketer, community manager, and International keynote speaker. Dorien runs More In Media and has been a social media professional for over 10 years. Starting as a local specialist, then learning about B2B, she is currently working with international brands as an organic specialist. You will recognize Dorien on stage and online by her orange glasses, a nod to her Dutch heritage.
Connect with Dorien on LinkedIn!
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Full transcript below:
Jennifer Mulchandani: [00:00:00] Hello and welcome to The M Word. My name is Jennifer Mulchandani.
Heather Myklegard: [00:00:03] And I’m Heather Myklegard.
Jennifer Mulchandani: [00:00:05] And today’s guest is Dorien Morin-van Dam with More In Media, born and raised in the Netherlands. Dorien came to the United States as an au pair. And then in 2012, she created a social media agency called More In Media and has grown to be a thriving agency that offers social media management strategy and much more. She’s also an international speaker on topics of video, social media, and other topics. Welcome Dorien.
Dorien Morin-van Dam: [00:00:33] Thank you for having me. I’m very excited to be here.
Jennifer Mulchandani: [00:00:37] Excited to have you. Why don’t you help us set the stage for our listeners and tell us a little bit about what you do in marketing, what your company is, and how that came to be.
Dorien Morin-van Dam: [00:00:48] Sure. Right now, I call myself an organic specialist. I really love content marketing, so really like the ideas, the execution of the content. I really [00:01:00] love blogging writing; which is really how Heather and I met through writing, initially. I also do graphics, and some other content as well as management also specializing in strategy. I do strategic plans for small businesses, as it pertains to marketing. I got started as a local social media manager. I used to live in Myrtle Beach, South Carolina. That’s where we raised our family, and when our kids were little, when the youngest one of four started kindergarten all of a sudden I had all these hours to fill my day. I took an online course in social media marketing, and remember in 2010, there really wasn’t anything available at college that you could take, most people came in from either communication or marketing or a combination, but there was no social media course that you could take online. And so, instead of going back to school, which I considered, I took it online courses, social media marketing, and literally put my shingle out on LinkedIn and called myself a social media manager and connected with a local charity who had no [00:02:00] social media presence. They gave me the title of social media director, which then locally made me like, okay, she’s working with the charity, gave me that credibility that I needed to start getting local clients and stayed local for a while and then moved to from B2C to more B2B, moved out of state with some clients. I’m now working with national clients, fewer clients, but bigger clients, and really specializing in organic social media. So, I actually work with several Facebook ad agencies who need somebody like me to do the organic for their clients while they’re running the ads.
Heather Myklegard: [00:02:38] So Dorien, in the beginning, you said that you love marketing and just now you’ve said that you love writing. I know you pretty well you’re an amazing writer. Talk to us more just about that, and you’ve been doing social media for a long time. Talk to us about your writing process: how do you come up with it? Is it a brain dump onto a document? Do you [00:03:00] talk it through, do you do a video first, talk to us about your writing process and what works for you?
Dorien Morin-van Dam: [00:03:05] Sure. I’ve been blogging since 2010, and I currently blog for three clients, so that’s quite a few blog posts every month. And then, of course, my own blogging kind of gets pushed to the side. But I definitely have a process in place for blog content. I usually bulk everything. At the beginning of the month, or maybe the month prior. I think about what’s upcoming. For example, one of the blog posts I’m writing this week is, “Don’t Be a Fool”, it’s going to go out this week, but then also highlighted on April Fool’s and that talks about don’t be a fool and forget to do your security cause this is for our home security business. So, I try to think about what’s going on in the world. And also I do keyword research, I start out with the idea of a title and I sometimes will do three titles, four titles. I have one client that I blog for every single week, I do up to eight titles at a time. I’ll come up with the idea, I [00:04:00] do the keyword research. Then I wordsmith the titles, making sure that they’re catchy and that people will click on them. A little bit of clickbait there. I sent those off to my graphic designer and they’d create the images to go with it. Then I will put them in a Google doc–all of those titles in a blank, Google doc. When I have another spot, maybe an hour somewhere, I will go and divide. Each blog post that I’m about to write into paragraphs. So I’ll write the headers for each paragraph. So now I always know there’s an introduction. There’s a, of course, an ending and then, what’s the idea that I really want to elaborate on. So put those headers and I try to go for five, but sometimes I end up with three. So then I have those three paragraphs ready to go. And so then when I’m ready to write. I already have an idea in my head, what I’m going to do. Then I just do a brain dump and I write then I have certain dates of the week that I sent them out that I have to publish. So then usually the day before I go [00:05:00] into the blogs, I upload them, do the SEO at the image, do all that back. And then I set it to go out usually early in the morning. And then right before I go and publish, I go in one more time and I read it out loud. That’s when I catch all my last little bits, I forgot a “to”, or forgot a “the” and “or” I read the article, out loud to myself and then I hit published. So that’s my process. I’m pretty quick at it. I think for certain I have one client I’ve been blogging for. Six years, three blogs a month, it’s a security company about security systems. So I can tell you about smart homes and commercial security and about the local community they’re in. And I’ve probably talked about it. Spring, summer, winter, fall, hurricane preparedness, there’s all these different topics and you can spin it different ways. But they’ve been very successful just with the blog, with the content because it’s new content every week. And so that really helps. So that keeps me going their phone [00:06:00] rings because Google likes them because we have new content on the website. And then I have several others. Companies that I blog for, but the process is really the same where I find these periods of times these blocks in my week or in my month where I can batch some of those things.
Jennifer Mulchandani: [00:06:17] So it sounds like I love all the processes you outlined. It probably helps combat writer’s block or, creates a way where you’re compartmentalizing your writing as opposed to feeling under the gun to write. But how do you advise your clients? Where does the content marketing strategy for fall in priority, is that the first thing you tell your clients that they really should be incorporating or is that come after a robust digital or social media strategy paid advertising? How do you approach what that marketing mix should be?
Dorien Morin-van Dam: [00:06:52] Alright. That’s a great question. Now don’t forget, I already mentioned that I’m the organic specialist, so I’ve, I work with people who [00:07:00] implement the paid strategy. So we work very closely together. So sometimes I create the graphics and the copy, and then we will. They will use that for the ads, which then we will publish to the organic feed. And at other times I created it for organic and they’ll say, Hey, we want to run a campaign. What do you have scheduled or outgoing that we can pull into a likes campaign or we can do. But when I work with my own clients, as a freelancer, everything starts with content. We have to figure out who their audience is. So we do a strategy, but then it’s all about the content. What are you willing as a business owner to share? How far, how much are you willing to share? Because the more they’re willing to share. The more successful they have, even though they say to me it’s all about the business. I just had this conversation with one of my clients. And I’m like, if you can just go give me some pictures, you know that she has a horse, she has a [00:08:00] barn, she’s got dogs. I’m like, even if you don’t want to be in the image, go outside on your lunch break and take a picture with your cup of coffee or your sandwiched standing near a horse, I just want to know what else you do. I know you’re a business owner. I can talk about that all day long, but those real pictures, the real videos, the real story of the business owner being in the business or taking a break from the business is really what is going to connect you with your audience. Yes. You share your expertise. Yes. You’re telling people that, you have a workshop coming up or that you have a new service or, you have a special, or they should hire you for something. But it’s really that human-to-human connections, that really is what sells and it comes through on social media. And especially if you’re active on LinkedIn I can share a blog post all day long, but I can tell you a picture of me holding a mug with some coffee in it. That gets me lots of likes. So you have to, that strategy has to include that human factor. I love that. It’s also more authentic.
Jennifer Mulchandani: [00:08:58] People want to [00:09:00] do business with people, not just nameless faceless brands, right? The more you can put your client as a person in it, the more people are going to respond.
Dorien Morin-van Dam: [00:09:09] Yes.
Jennifer Mulchandani: [00:09:10] You’ve been in the biz for quite a while. It’s as you noted, like when you started like the schooling available, even for being a social media marketing professional was very different access to training. How has your approach to social media change? What’s not the technical behind the scenes, but like, how have you evolved in the way that you do social media now that you didn’t do back then?
Dorien Morin-van Dam: [00:09:36] I think the strategy part for sure. And the systems when I started as a social media manager, I was very hands-on. I was doing all aspects of social media, which is great because I know all aspects of social media. But what I didn’t have is that background of business knowledge and systems knowledge, and that’s come in the last three or [00:10:00] four years to me where I had processes in place, but I didn’t name them. And I, they, I couldn’t hand them off to somebody. What I’ve learned is if I put a process in place to name it and to use tools, to be able to duplicate them. That way I can hand off my tasks to somebody else, that’s the only way to grow. As far as social media, I have the big picture I’ve seen. I’ve seen platforms come and go right now, clubhouses being my clients has asked me about Clubhouse and she went on this weekend. And what do you think, Dorien? And I’m just really cautious about those things. There’s cycles for all of that, but a lot of the same strategy applies. If you’re looking, if you’re thinking about looking back to say, for example, Facebook ads three years ago, and you would login now for the first time, that interface is completely different. People go, whoa, I don’t know all of the same principles of marketing still apply. So as long as you understand [00:11:00] how marketing works and if you have strategies in place and, think about repurposing content, a lot of that doesn’t change. It’s just the tools we use change there is a new platform maybe to incorporate, but the overall. Marketing. You still have to communicate. You have to listen, you have to engage. You have to build your community. You have to build your audience. You have to have an offer. You have to have a funnel. All those things are still there. It just might look a little bit different. So that’s what I’ve seen. And the people that are still in it when Heather and I were first starting at people there, we, I feel like old school, like I have this knowledge, this. Way back when we did it this way. And I sometimes feel bad for people who are just getting in it because they haven’t seen that progress. Yet I know there’s a huge opportunity. It was just telling Heather that through COVID so many more small businesses have had to pivot and go online. And even though I have clients that I have been telling [00:12:00] forever, you need to do video. You need to do that. They might have been hesitant, but yeah. Due to what happened to COVID. They’ve had to do that pivot. They’ve had to go online and be more technical. And so there’s a huge opportunity for people to support businesses like that. Our marketing industry has really grown and we’re embracing all the new people that are in this business. There’s room for a lot of room, for more people to join us. And especially those with skills and willing to work and learn. It’s hopping. It’s really happening.
Heather Myklegard: [00:12:32] Dorien as an organic strategist, as you’re calling yourself and your specialty, talk to us about some of these guerrilla tactics that you have been doing, or that you’ve tried over the last few years, what do those look like?
Dorien Morin-van Dam: [00:12:46] I think. It’s all about where you are. And when I started out, I was in a local community. I lived in Myrtle beach, South Carolina. And again, when I started out, there was nobody else who called themselves a [00:13:00] social media manager in the area at all. So there were a lot of small business owners who were very curious about. That Twitter was, or that Twitter as they called it. And, I didn’t really know how to create a Facebook group or, what was Instagram when it came. So I was teaching people how to do that, but I was also because I had lived in that community for over 10 years. When I started, I was really well connected to the community. And so I was able to, as a guerrilla tactic, as you would maybe call it. I was able to match up my clients with other locals, either organizations or businesses. And we would team up on different marketing campaigns. For example, that security company that I talked about earlier, wanted to support a local charity. So we went to the charity and we did a video with them. And then they became a sponsor to an event. I have had a client who was a college counselor, who, of course, his target audience is. [00:14:00] Parents of kids who are in high school. So we hooked him up with a local driving school. Who had the same target audience, right? So they put in the marketing campaign together. So he was teaching some of his college classes at the location of the driving school and they were marketing together and sending newsletters to these parents. Then there was a company who did self-defense that I worked with. It was a nonprofit organization who teamed up with a local running store. I had written a strategy for, and they did a self-defense class for runners. So those are the kind of marketing, if your marketing dollars are your budget is small. Think about who else has your same audience and work with them and create campaigns, especially within a community. And even if it’s a larger city, you can find other people who have similar objectives. And that worked out really well. So I think people just. They’re so afraid to collaborate. They’re so afraid that there’s competition or that it’s going to be diluted. But when [00:15:00] you, as a business give and you give freely and you embrace the other business and you lift them up only good things happen. And I think people are so afraid to do that. But that’s one of the tactics that still, I think, still works and that people just forget to do it.
Jennifer Mulchandani: Have you ever tried anything that just completely bombed?
Dorien Morin-van Dam: Oh, yeah, of course I have one company, one local business that we thought we would do some memes and, they didn’t do very well. And I had one local business. I had to convince the owner to do a series of videos and I brought my tripod and I brought my lighting kit and everything. And I booked a whole time and she literally stood in front of the camera and cried. I can’t do it. She said ,” I can’t be in these videos when you’re in the videos. It worked and I can’t do it.” and it bombed. And so I had to go back to, me either showcasing [00:16:00] her business or, using still pictures. I couldn’t use the video, she just wasn’t ready, and I don’t think she’s ready and she can’t be on camera and that’s okay. That happens sometimes, I was going to get her a coach and she’s I just don’t even want to do it, and so that’s okay. We tried and I felt like I tried to convince her for a while to do it. And then it just didn’t happen. And that’s okay. We were able to figure out other ways to continue to support and showcase her business .
Jennifer Mulchandani: [00:16:28] And that’s what’s so great about, having all those tools in your marketing toolkit, right? It’s that you don’t have to do everything for everybody. It’s about finding that connection for that client that feels good and is great. So I’m curious because, I. Just knowing that you’re how connected you are in the social media marketing professional world, too. What have you seen, or do you see that makes you cringe? Marketing that’s being done on social media that isn’t being done well?
[00:17:00] Dorien Morin-van Dam: [00:17:00] Oh, there’s lots of things that make me French. So I have to be honest about this. No, as some of that is personality, right? I know you when you introduced me, everybody heard that I am Dutch and the Dutch are very pragmatic. They’re very calm, cool, and collected. And so it’s not in our nature to self promote. It’s not in our nature to say, look at me, you look at me. So I see who’s self-imposed, self- proclaimed gurus out there who are doing a lot of, look at me, and that just makes me cringe yet. I know that it gets them leads. So that’s one thing. There are still people out there who are buying likes, buying an audience, buying followers and not necessarily other social media professionals, but there are agencies out there that do that. One of the things that I’m struggling with is not struggling, but that’s happening right now. As a content manager for one of my clients I probably get pitched two to three times [00:18:00] a day. Day for people who want backlinks from me. Because this blog is doing really well and they’re in a social media fair. And so people are literally pitching saying, I have written these articles. They would be really good for you. Can you just link to my blog and don’t offer me anything? And I was like, I’m a person here and I have a business to run. And how about you say, would you like to collaborate together or I have something that could benefit you and if you would consider adding a back link, I would maybe consider adding a back link too, so I am constantly telling people I will consider it if you consider it, what are you going to give me? Here you’re taking time to come into my inbox. And you want something from me, but you don’t offer anything. And it’s people that I don’t know, people that compliment me on my blog, but I could tell they haven’t readily read it. So that’s really a big one that I’m [00:19:00] dealing with right now. I’m trying to figure out the right message because sometimes it’s, they don’t know how to do it. And sometimes I’ve continued to converse and we ended up working together. But most of the time it’s like, Nope. No, thank you. This is not a good fit. But that’s one of the things that’s happening right now. People are asking for backlinks and they’re just, they don’t really have a good strategy for it. So interesting that cause what I’m hearing you talk about too, is like it’s being reactive and marketing versus having that strategy and you setting the stage for what you want to accomplish in your own business, but you’re having to react to all of these potential offers. And I think that they can trip up a lot of businesses when they don’t know what their own strategy should be. Then you don’t know how to react, but having a plan and knowing what you want for your own marketing, it’s going to help you be a filter for all of that. Absolutely. Yeah. So we, as a team have said, if we can get a blog post out of it, that would be good, but we have blog requirements for it to be a guest blog and one [00:20:00] of the first things I’ve learned is if you want a back link and you want to write for me, I need to see what you’re going to link to. So the first thing I say to them is this could be a possibility. Yes. I consider you to give you a back link, if you write me a blog post, but I need to know what the link is first, because I’ve learned to not let them write anything until I have the link. And then they give me a link and I’m like, no, I can’t link to that. And then, we, that, so that’s part of what I’m dealing with, but yeah. Having a strategy in place for what you want to accomplish when people contact you is important. There’s a really good point, Jennifer.
Heather Myklegard: [00:20:37] And Dorien, I want to go back to the comments about people buying so that say what we in the business would call a vanity metric, right? People want this big number for Facebook followers, Twitter followers. What metrics do you consider to be valuable? And how do you tell your clients, interpreting metrics, what’s important and what should they be looking [00:21:00] for?
Dorien Morin-van Dam: [00:21:00] So the first metric would be growth. Any kind of growth. So you can’t measure growth if you don’t have a baseline. So any client I start with a social media audit. I need to know where you are right now. I need to know your footprint right now on social media. It doesn’t matter if you’re just starting or if you’ve been doing business for five years or 10 years, I need to know where you are and what kind of engagement you have and what kind of content you have.
And then we look for engagement, right? What are people talking about? Are they reacting? Are they just reacting and not talking? Are you asking the right questions? And then growth. Yeah. We want to follow a growth for sure. But we really want people to click links. We really want them to go and do something, so there’s a call to action. So depending on, and this is every, any strategy starts with a goal. So if your goal is to sell a service, You need to have people clicking somewhere on your website in order to sell that service, or you need them to click on a demo, right? So it just all depends on what your goals are and what you want to do. [00:22:00] Vanity metrics are still important to business owners and I get it, and it is more important than bigger companies I work with because they have stakeholders. They have shareholders. They have, they might have been, ready for maybe there’s a takeover or maybe they’re thinking about selling their business. So it’s important to them to have that and they’re comparing themselves to their competitors. So there is still room for likes campaigns, running Facebook ads. But buying likes doesn’t do anything to bring down that reach and that engagement, because those are not really real people. And once you explain. Playing that part, it’s usually pretty evident, but it’s very tempting. It’s very cheap. It’s very cheap. You can just get a bunch of bots to like, and get to a thousand likes on Facebook in five minutes. So I can see where that’s, for somebody who doesn’t know anything that’s attractive, but ultimately that’s going to hurt you because then when you do hire somebody they’re going to have to manually remove all of those in order to get any traction. So really what I’m looking for [00:23:00] is. What are people talking to, either on Facebook or LinkedIn to the page about what they are saying? Are they liking your videos? Are they watching your videos? Are they clicking through? Are they dying anything when you have a call to action or you have a funny post, are people engaging with you? That’s really it. Yeah. You can have all these business blogs and all these things going out, but if you post a picture of yourself holding a cut, a cup of coffee, do they know your name? Do they know who you are? If you’re the business owner, do they, can they name you? They’re going to inquire about your dog or inquire about your daughter going off to college or going to inquire about it. Hey, is there still snow in Vermont? So if they start talking to you about those other things you might’ve mentioned, you have an engaged audience. Growth looks different for every single business owner. And so it really. For me it’s any strategy. The first question I ask is, what are your goals? Why do you want to be on social media? What do you want to accomplish? And then we go about accomplishing that. Yeah. I think just setting that [00:24:00] benchmark is so important to make sure that you’re able to go back and see if this is working. And it also goes back to that relationship, we want to make a relationship and a connection.
Heather Myklegard: [00:24:11] I want to change directions just a bit. You are an international speaker, you do videos a lot, you’re a writer I know that you’ve helped your clients get in front of cameras and you’ve helped your clients get speaking. Is there anything out there that scares you? Is there anything that you haven’t yet tried that?
Dorien Morin-van Dam: [00:24:32] Yes. And as you’re asking the question, I have a pit in my stomach,
Heather Myklegard: [00:24:35] Ooh, Tell us.
Dorien Morin-van Dam: [00:24:36] I want to write a book. I have put it on my eye every October. I make my own strategy. And I write out a strategy for the next year. I go over what worked this year? What do I want to accomplish? I’ve put writing a book on my strategy, several years and as I was sharing before I have four kids and there were a couple of years that teenage years were really hard. And so I [00:25:00] didn’t get to accomplish that. I want to put that back on my list. I also have created a social media course in 2015, that I never launched. I’m thinking about redoing that relaunching a course and relaunching my own live show, which I had. Sometimes life gets in the way and that’s okay. I know you’re both mothers as well, and when you have to, pick one over the other, then it’s very easy to say, “I can put that aside.” But I have some of those goals and those things scare me. It’s very easy for me to be on a podcast and somebody else hosts it, but to commit to something weekly or commit to, and I have to ask the questions. It’s a little bit harder. So those things do scare me to keep that running in the long term. And part of that is, and that’s my own insecurity and I’m very transparent. It was that initially that credibility versus credentials. And usually people have something when they get started. I had neither a high school diploma. I do not have a college degree. I had been out of the [00:26:00] workforce. I’d never actually been in an official work environment. I’d been a nanny and then a mom. So I’d never been part of a business, so it was really hard for me to get past my own thinking,” I’m not good enough or why am I doing this?” And even though I jumped in. It was still very scary. So I have gotten past that by doing certification. I have a certification as a social media manager from a social media strategist with Social Media Pro, I became an Agile Marketer last year, which was a two day full immersion workshop, which was right before COVID, which is really cool. And that’s really helped me grow my business, the agile framework. So I feel like I’m beyond that. I should be beyond that now. But I still have that imposter syndrome sometimes. So that the, if you asking me what scares you, that kind of scares me am I getting too big for my britches?
Jennifer Mulchandani: [00:26:49] Dorien, I think, I don’t know if there’s a single client that we’ve worked with and we work with some rockstar, founders, entrepreneurs. Who’ve grown [00:27:00] massive footholds in the community who haven’t at some point shared with me, their, that exact feeling. And I know I’ve felt it too. It is so universal, but I think we all sweep it under the rug because that’s vulnerable, and it’s not what we want to project to potential clients, but I think it’s what keeps us real and grounded. And I think, honestly, when I hear you talk, I feel like that’s what separates someone. Who’s a true professional from someone who is out there. Just telling me, because they have some confidence. It doesn’t mean they have the ability to make it work so kudos to you. And I would love to know as we’re coming towards the end here you’ve shared quite a few of the credentials that you’ve achieved and your own studying, but who in the business, or what source in the business do you look up to for whether it’s inspiration or ongoing training or upkeep of your skills?
Dorien Morin-van Dam: [00:27:54] So there’s quite a few people in the business who are the real deal. I’m lucky [00:28:00] enough to have been able to attend a live workshop as part of my international speaking circuit. In 2017 to October, 2016, my goal was to become a paid speaker. And that meant in 2017, I had to get onto 12 stages because I realized in order to become a paid speaker, you have to have a speaking resume, and so I did that. And the other part, the other thing that I’ve done, if I’ve invested time and going and money into going to these conferences and as a freelancer. That’s a lot of money to fly out, to say social media marketing world and California, or to an inbound in Boston. But in order to do that I invested in that and that’s where I’ve met some really amazing people. Heather and I have met on the social media marketing world several times, which is amazing. Mari Smith, who. Is the queen of Facebook she’s as real as can be. I love her and she just has incredible knowledge. I’m very good friends with Viveka von Rosen, who is the LinkedIn [00:29:00] expert. She lives in Colorado. We met at a COVID wedding in Vermont because her best friend lives in Vermont here. And, really got to know her. I love her. And so there’s real gems out there. Another one is Jessica Phillips who is young and, is raising three young girls and has this kick ass agency that she’s running and she just invests a lot of time in self-care and growing, and I love her and what she does, and she’s somebody who gave me a chance to speak at her conference. And so there’s quite a few women, especially that I look up to that are. The real deal that is, might be a little more quiet on social media than others, but working, and they’re there, they’re doing the hard work and they’re showing what can be done and not just saying what should be done. And those are just a few, there’s plenty of others out there as well.
Heather Myklegard: [00:29:56] Dorien, if you could go back to 2010, [00:30:00] 2011, when you and I were in that social collective, and we were starting to write and explore social media what would you tell yourself back then about what you know now?
Dorien Morin-van Dam: [00:30:13] Invest five to 10 hours a week, maybe half a day or a full day, a week in business development. It came a little late to me and I realized that it was important that I do that. And it’s fine. It was my own pace, but I would have said Dorien, you can do it. Go spend four hours a week or eight hours a week. Block that time and go do that learning, get certified, maybe take a business class at night, learn how to run a business as a business woman, you are a business woman. And I use that freelancer a lot and a social media manager. And I even use that word just a lot. And I don’t do that anymore, or I try not to do that anymore. Not use that. I am a social media strategist, and I am an organic specialist. And those are the things that if I had to go tell [00:31:00] myself, go do those a lot earlier, I would have probably developed. Some of the skills I have a lot quicker on the other hand, I’m very proud of the journey. Because I had four kids at home, I moved from South Carolina to Vermont, there were a lot of things in my life that I had to take care of. So I think the timing was just perfect, but maybe would’ve, give myself a little kick in the butt there a little earlier.
Jennifer Mulchandani: [00:31:21] That’s right. You are a social media strategist and a marketing expert, and we appreciate the time that you spent here so much during where can our listeners find you if they want more of your wisdom?
Dorien Morin-van Dam: [00:31:36] All right. Actually the more is where you can get it More In Media. That’s my handle. I was lucky enough to get that everywhere. So, on LinkedIn, my LinkedIn handle is More In Media and on no on Instagram, on Twitter. But also my name is pretty unique. I think there’s only one Dorien Morin-van Dam. I use that vanDam is the Dutch. It’s my Dutch last name. And in the Netherlands, once you’re born with that name, it will [00:32:00] always stay with you in my passport. I’m Dorien vanDam and my Dutch passport. It’s pretty unique. And then always look for the orange glasses. So either Morin Media or Dorien Morin-van Dam there is just one me out there, so it’s easy to find me. And I would love for you to connect with me on LinkedIn.
Jennifer Mulchandani: [00:32:15] That is great. Thank you again for sharing all of these nuggets of wisdom. I know I learned a lot and enjoy hearing about your journey and your expertise, and I know our listeners will too. So thank you for tuning in and we’ll see you soon.
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